The Sequoia Breeze

Rebecca: Welcome to the Sequoia Breeze Podcast, a breath of fresh air for your homeschool. I am your host, Rebecca LaSavio.

Liz: I couldn't remember what I was gonna say. Keep it.

Liza: Yeah.

Rebecca: I just might have to listeners, welcome to a special episode for me. I am recording with two wonderful people that I happen to be related to. So I'm excited to introduce you to two of my sister in laws. So I'm going to let them introduce themselves. Eliza, let's start with you.

Liza: So my relation to you is I am sister in law David Reed's wife and I am an owner and director of a small preschool in Shingle Springs, Montessori based philosophy and. Yeah.

Rebecca: How many kids do you have?

Liza: Anywhere from 12 to 14 a day.

Rebecca: How many kids do you have?

Liza: Anywhere from 12 to 14 a day. I have my own kids. I have four kids ranging from 13 to 21.

Rebecca: You're bridging all the phases.

Liza: Yes. The sad, empty nester, the adolescent. Yes.

Rebecca: All the way down to the preschooler.

Liza: Yes.

Rebecca: And Liz.

Liz: I'm Liz Harmon. I am your other sister in law. One of your other sister in laws. You married my brother. I have five kids. I homeschool and I'm also starting a little TK slash K group from my youngest son to be a part of. But I've thoroughly enjoyed the homeschooling process the whole way through. So my oldest is 12. He's in seventh grade this year and my youngest is only two. So he gets to toddle along with whatever group we do and all of the field trips that we do and he has a blast doing it. So I have, I have somewhere between seventh grade and kind of a preschooler.

Rebecca: I invited you guys here today because we do things somewhat differently at our homes, but I think a lot of our base philosophies are kind of the same. And I would say especially maybe in the preschool years as it's made it kind of easy for our kids to be together because we, I don't know, I feel like we've had re reasonably the same expectations for behavior, what we wanted to accomplish at that developmental age. And so we as family liaisons at Sequoia Grove have noticed a real uptick in parents who are approaching that TK kindergarten age calling sometimes long before they're ready to enroll. And they're often feeling a little panicky of I have to start this. I have this important job to do, but I don't know where to start. And I'm not sure how much is too much and how much is too Little. And so I excited to have you guys here to help address that issue with our kids. Liz, what have the preschool years looked like at your house? I mean, they've been going on for a long time.

Liz: The first word that comes to mind is chaos. Not necessarily controlled chaos, but just a lot of fun and wonderment. And I think I come a little bit in between the feeling that there is pressure to teach them and. But most of it should be done through enjoyable things. For instance, I really like. I do like to get things done in the kindergarten year because I think it makes the rest of the years more successful and it flows more smoothly. But how I do that is a little hodgepodge and. And not for everyone. You know, I just kind of see what I think a child ought to know, and I find good books for it. So we've had so many good books and so many days at the park and so many conversations and cuddle sessions and, you know, things that, when you think about it, it's really just childhood years. It's not necessarily doing a full curriculum or anything like that.

Rebecca: When you say you want to get things done in kindergarten to make it easier later, what kind of things are you talking about?

Liz: Beginning reading skills, beginning math skills, learning to sit at a desk for a little while, a very little while. I guess it's a little bit like you want them to be able to do things well and know what that actually looks like. So you're not aiming for three hours of wiggles. You're aiming for five minutes of sitting still and attention, and you're not aiming to get a bunch of questions done throughout the day. It really depends on your kid, obviously. But my first child really was a slower learner. And so it was. If you could get that one question answered well and teach them what good looks like at a young age, that's fantastic. And if you can get some of the phonics out of the way at a young age, it means that later, when they're reading and their brain is so full of curiosity, they can. So I think I personally spend a little extra attention on phonics and reading, but all in small snippets, because I don't want poor work. I want them to do it well.

Rebecca: So you'd rather have five minutes of success than an hour of cajoling? Yes. Okay.

Liz: Yeah, for sure. Because then when they carry it on into 10 minutes, it's 10 minutes of good work and not two hours of cajoling. I mean, it can turn into an awful, bitter fight, and then no one likes it. But if you can do it well for just a short amount of time.

Rebecca: Then they ask for it the next.

Liz: Day and they ask for it the next day. I would. It's that weird, like, mom guilt of when they ask for more that day and you say, no, I don't think. I don't think we have it in us to do it well for any longer. But then you feel like, am I depriving you of your education?

Liza: Nope.

Liz: Let them go.

Rebecca: So, Liza, what do the preschool years look like at your house? Preschool, Kindergarten?

Liza: Yeah, I would say I like what you said, Liz, as far as it made me, I guess, two things with my own children and then with preschoolers, I have that observation of the child sort of as the starting point of any curriculum you're trying to look at. So in the case of my own children, I think just really watching what they're interested in and then going towards that and providing, like you said, rich books to read and environments to be in. And it feels like I probably didn't know this deeply enough when I was doing it with my own children. But just how, if you're in those rich environments, it's just sort of a catalyst to all sorts of education. So almost. I mean, anything can be a jumping off point.

Liz: Right.

Liza: As we know. So I think for. But I think important to sort of on that very day, like, are they in a learning place? Are they sick? Have they had good rest? Do they need outside time, inside time? All those type of things. Food. Food, Yep. And. Yeah. And just being aware of that. And then are they. Yeah. Wanting more? Are they hungry for more math? Or are they hungry for more reading and sort of watching even their breaking points when they might feel like a little oversaturated, annoying when sort of pull back and just let it be for the day. So, yeah, that's one of the main principles in Montessori, which I realized I did with my own children. But then learning the purpose of that was really neat to just put it into those words, you know. So as a teacher, I try to come to the day there's. They talk about the spiritual preparedness of a teacher. So having those kids in mind, remembering that.

Rebecca: Oh, yeah.

Liza: So. And so went to Oregon last, you know, yesterday, and they just got home. They might be exhausted. And so I'm not going to try to tackle X, Y or Z.

Liz: But.

Liza: And then having that idea of sort of where they're coming into their day and then seeing things that they might be avoiding that you might kind of think, okay, I think they need to come towards this, and maybe this is a day they feel strong and sturdy and they need to come toward this work. And then some days, you know, kind of like, yeah, I think this is a day to just, you know, put their toes deep into the sandbox and hang out outside for a little while. So I feel like observation. I was going to bring a quote in. I think it's attention is the beginning of devotion. MARY OLIVER but sort of that idea of our love for something begins by looking at it and watching it and sort of devoting ourselves to it for a moment so that we can sort of see what it's asking of us. So I like that because so often I think we can be hurried and kind of frantic and, oh my gosh, am I doing enough or do I need, you know, maybe I need to go get some more materials or something. But when you kind of sit there in a place and you're watching and listening so many times the answer for what is next is given. Right? But it takes that stillness of the teacher or the mother teacher or the father teacher to do that.

Rebecca: So would you both agree that. I think we all put a lot of attention into things like answering the curious questions that our kids give us or talking about, like, a trip to the grocery store isn't necessarily just a trip to the grocery store, but it's identifying which fruits and vegetables do you see, which colors are they? Or hey, what's over there? Or can you count those for me? Or would you both agree that that's something you put some effort into is just those kinds of conversations driving down the road or out and about.

Liz: Yes.

Liza: Absolutely.

Liz: I would, I would, I would go maybe one step deeper into, like, those are life skill moments. This is what a rotten apple looks like. This is how you search for a good head of lettuce. And you know what I like, I don't, I don't necessarily even go for counting. I go for, this is how it affects your family. This is if you buy all the soft ones and they're too soft now, then we get home and we've spoiled all the food and all of the money that we made. And yeah, we have good conversations when we shop, even if it is a little bit extra work to bring them with us. And it's also a great, another great way to teach self containment and self control and awareness of others. No lost opportunity.

Rebecca: Which leads me into the next piece that. Would you guys both agree that those sort of five and under years are most particularly focused on character Development instead rather than scholastic development.

Liza: Oh, gotcha.

Liz: I am nodding my head.

Liza: I mean, I think whole person. So it's sort of all of those simultaneously. But yeah. And in the Montessori curriculum, we call it grace and courtesy, but we have so much fun at circle time kind of doing act outs where we'll kind of act it out the wrong way of doing it or sort of a way that might not end up being the most kind way and then the other way. And it's fun to just. You realize there's so many teaching moments as far as grace and courtesy goes, because yeah, they, they really so often they just don't know how they're supposed to act. And so it's neat when you feel like, oh, it's just this hasn't been taught. It's not necessarily that they're trying to be, you know, pill in the grocery store. But like, yeah, how could we say this differently? Or you know, those type of opportunities I love. I think that's one of my. When I see the kids reframe things, I'm just like totally blown away and excited because it's like, wow, we really can hear things and change and listen and develop our characters and, and modeling. Right. Is a huge part of it. And I've had to check that in my own teaching as I go because you can sort of say, don't take anything out of anybody's hands and then suddenly you find yourself reaching for something. And those, all those lessons are good to digest. Myself again too.

Rebecca: I've spent a lot of time with my kids, especially when they were little and didn't necessarily know what's going on around them. But I still do it. Setting expectations. I think sometimes a kid can fall apart in the grocery store or doing a math lesson because they're pretty sure it's never going to end and they're going to spend the rest of their lives sitting here and they're hungry and there's no end in sight, you know, so if they know we're going to go grab three more things and then we're checking out, we're getting out of here and have a snack for you in the car or whatever, you know, when, when kids know what to expect and that needs are going to be met and there is an end point.

Liza: Scaffolding experience in order so that the child can potentially be successful. It doesn't always work, but it's so nice for them to know like, yeah, what's coming next and can I almost like that Control, self control to be like Okay. I think I can make it through a couple more minutes and, you know. Versus just.

Rebecca: Yeah.

Liza: That they. I mean, the whole time thing is a huge thing for kids at that age.

Rebecca: And if that doesn't work, distraction is huge at this age. Like, Right. You can just say something funny and suddenly they're laughing instead of throwing a fit or. You know, I think one of the things that was always a priority for me with my preschoolers is that I wanted my kids to be pleasant to be around. I didn't want it. I didn't want to take my kids places and have people frustrated that they were there or, you know, so that was definitely something I was working to train them with at that age.

Liza: Yeah. And jumping in there. I. One thing, I think when I first started parenting, I would almost go to embarrassment really fast because I, like, I felt like I was failing, but realizing a little bit further down the road, like, giving them the opportunity to redo it at that moment is a really neat thing. And again, a nice life skill. Like, shoot, yeah, let's not run right in front of that old person at the door. Like, how could you do that again? And make sure that you're careful of the. You know, and it's just. It's a nice. Like, those teaching moments are so powerful because. Yeah, they're real. Right.

Rebecca: And in order to take advantage of them, you have to most of the time, not be in too big of a rush.

Liza: Yes, you're right. Yep.

Rebecca: What's the quote you have at your house? Hurry is. You have a quote about hurry at your house, Liz? I do, yeah. There's no love and hurry. Is that what it is?

Liza: Oh, that's a good one.

Liz: I remember that's from a book.

Liza: I think you have a childlike wonderment on your face.

Liz: I think that's such a beautiful quote. I should put it somewhere. It's so true. Oh, and it really. I mean, it resonates with me, because as soon as you start hurrying, our own needs rise above the needs of those around us. And a lot of times the reason we're hurrying is because we don't want to look bad somewhere. And the reason we're frustrated with our kids is because we don't want to look bad in front of the people that are around us. But there's just these tiny humans that need a lot of grace and patience. And the more we show them, the more they learn about it. And, yeah, there's no love and hurry. What a good saying.

Rebecca: I think, honestly, we as grownups sometimes forget that Our kids don't know. Yeah, we forget that they've never had a chance to learn this. I remember. Okay, between both sides of the family that I'm talking to here, there are what, 18, 19 grandchildren? I don't know. There's a lot. And every once in a while, and they're in fairly similar age groupings, by and large. And so at one point, there's could be a really big number of 2 to 6 year olds in a room. And I remember thinking, do they know what we mean when we say sit still? Like, do we know what sit still means? Like we. Or be quiet. You know, when we say be quiet as adults, we actually mean your whole body. We aren't just talking about what comes out of your mouth, you know, do we understand that? We're saying don't hit the table, don't kick your feet. We're asking you to not make noise with, with anything. And I think sometimes, especially not always, but especially with a lot of little boys, like, that doesn't compute. I'm not talking.

Liz: What's the matter? Okay, so bringing this full circle around into their little educational environment where you can take that whole idea is when we say sit still at the table, if they're doing something that's driving us as mothers nuts, we might have to spell it out a little bit better than sit still or, you know, be quiet or even come here. I might mean come here right away. Not when you're done with whatever game you're playing or, you know, go fetch your brother means right now. Not. Not when you're done asking your 40 questions or like there's so many things that will save us a lot of grief as we're putting it into their education. If we remember that they don't. They, they don't know every word or nuance or things like that.

Liza: And giving them a really good. That's the acting out. We do it. It sounds like I'm acting out, like, and being a bad kid at preschool. But when we serve, like, if someone's speaking too loud, we don't just model it for them. We don't want it up here. Let's talk a little bit more like this, you know, and it's just nice. You realize, yeah, these, these words can feel completely hollow to them because they're like, what are you saying? And then you show them. And it makes so much sense, you know, and so showing them is a really wonderful way of getting it implanted in their brains.

Rebecca: So this sort of leads into. We've addressed it a Little bit, but let's be more specific. So what do 4 to 5 year olds need at this age? And we can go through, like, developmentally, educationally and socially. And I realize this is, this is not like the.

Liz: But can I just jump in?

Rebecca: This is not a scholastic. Yeah, I have lost my words. This is not a scholastic podcast. But, like, what, what would you say?

Liz: You know, I think developmentally is be careful saying that they should be anywhere at 4 or 5 because I feel like they're so different. And so anytime you're worried about it, I would say find another mom you trust and ask them, is this worth worrying about? Because chances are it's not. But sometimes it is. You know, sometimes there might actually be a problem.

Liza: Yeah.

Liz: But a lot of times it's just something they'll grow out of. But you have these, you know, I don't want to like, say genders per se, but there are some gender differences in learning and how quickly girls develop things and put things together. And there are some boys that are like that too, but it's just kind of a typical thing. And then there are some kids that are such sweet, slow learners. So developmentally they'll reach the milestones at different times. And I would just say put very little pressure on where they are.

Rebecca: I mean, I had one that had full sentences at 14 months and another that was barely talking at three and a half.

Liz: Yeah. And potty training and the ability to buckle yourself and dress yourself.

Rebecca: And they can all do that now.

Liz: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Rebecca: And the one that didn't speak until three and a half, four.

Liz: Try to stop him now.

Rebecca: Yeah. And I bet he's got a better vocabulary than our listeners.

Liz: Yeah.

Liza: Absolutely. Yeah. I would say, I mean, going back to the beginning of our conversation, just that what should we provide them with? A rich environment. I know I've been using a lot of Montessori terms, but a prepared environment is what they call it in a Montessori setting. And it's sort of the idea of you've thought through something kind of that your child might want to come towards. So maybe like, gosh, they've been so into water. Right. So you want to. You're going to have pouring things and they're going to be helping you with the dishes and they're going to be. They want to do those purposeful activities. So sort of maybe set up a couple that they can do over and over and over again. Now that's sort of the kinesthetic. That would be sort of practical life stuff. But then.

Rebecca: But you Also I just want to interject there because knowing you, you're not just giving them a bucket of water and a pitcher and saying have fun and they're pouring water all over the house. Right. Like you, you're putting that within very specific parameters that they know.

Liza: Yes. And so sort of you, you first again, you model how the work will go and then they'll do and they always have variations and stuff. You kind of have certain parameters like yeah, you're not going to take the whole tray and spill it all over the ground.

Liz: Right.

Liza: Or if you do, there are the rags, you know, and setting up that environment. But I would say just like you said that idea of the rich environment, every child is different and it is an interesting thing to be a really keen observer. Like I said before, you're kind of seeing is this child always avoiding like do they need a little bit more sensory stuff and do they need to kind of come towards the finger paints or are they wanting sort of avoiding that. But you know, they could kind of use that input or same thing with. They might be, they might know they're kind of good at pre reading and stuff, but always avoiding math. You know, you might sort of lead them there and get them comfortable in that material. And so I guess just being able to see what they're needing in that next step.

Rebecca: So, so what I think I've heard you both say is what they need at this age is direction that, that they can understand parameters or limits for what's acceptable and what's not, both behaviorally and other things. They need success to taste what that looks like. And I think we've touched a little on learning to survive being uncomfortable a little bit. You know, like we have to finish this grocery trip or yeah, you need to wait your turn or you know, there will be food.

Liza: Yep.

Rebecca: You're not going to starve to death. You know those kinds of things.

Liza: Yep.

Rebecca: How much social interaction do you think 4 and 5 year olds need or where do you think that primary interaction should come from?

Liz: I, I personally think the primary interaction should come from your family. People might disagree because they want to get them out of the house and go play with another five year old. But the person who's going to model the behavior best is just you. You're going to model all sorts of things well for them. And I'm not at all saying that you shouldn't have lots of play dates. I'm just saying that don't go out of your way to put your kids in a class full of 10 other kids, because you think that they need socialization. I think the parents are great examples and the kids will still play make believe. I would actually go out of my way a little bit to try to create an atmosphere of, for lack of a better word, downtime. Just giving them space to decompress from things around. But also I will say that now, you know, we have five and we're always on the go. So for me, that's really difficult to create.

Rebecca: What it looked like for your first two is not what it looks like for your fifth, right?

Liz: For my first, for my first couple, if there's any first couple hanging out, we would just have a couple times a week play dates at the park and spend a lot of time just together. Kid helping me cook, kid helping me clean, kid pulling lots of books off of lots of shelves, putting books back on the shelves. But I think, I think just lots of home time and mimicking mom and mimicking dad and making sure that the world that you're creating that they're mimicking is one worth copying too.

Rebecca: That's a good point.

Liz: Takes a little bit of self reflection there.

Liza: Yeah. Or a lot. Yeah, I would say, I think it's such a personal decision. You also know your own children. Like I had my first, didn't go to preschool and went straight into kindergarten. But we would try to cultivate just spaces where we could be interacting with other families and stuff. But I mean, I think it kind of is that balance that you have to find with your own child.

Rebecca: I mean, he wasn't super interested in being social at that age either, was he?

Liza: Yeah, he was more of a parallel play type guy. But I would say that the richness I see in the preschool environment is there are just sort of things that can come about and conversations and independence that can be had within the preschool. That is unique, I guess, because there's only two of us and there are 12 or sometimes three adults. It's like there are these little times that are just sort of these special times. They might need to be more independent because we can't be right there. And that's sort of the whole purpose of it, is sort of creating that independence and that ability to do things on your own. And I would say just that sense of kind of creating their own little community and within that, having that community space to work out. I always tell parents, like, we don't try to avoid conflict here. When I first started, someone would start crying or something would happen and I'd be like, oh no, I'm failing. And Then realizing, oh, no, this is the beauty of it. These moments are these springboards again for. For learning about interpersonal relationship and how to express our feelings. That's a big thing we focus on, which is so neat to see the children being able to identify their feelings instead of act them out really quickly and impulsively. So. So all those opportunities that come about in that setting, really special and unique. But I don't think it's either one is sort of. I mean, I think, of course, the home is where it all starts. And then it's like if you have a child that is interested in having that social experience and sort of that type of setup, awesome. You know, and some kids aren't geared that way, or some, even families aren't geared that way, which makes total sense. But I think it is a rich.

Rebecca: Opportunity, and I want to put a plug in here for parents. If it's never occurred to you to really think about what should the sibling relationships and your families look like? Our culture tells us in all of the kids shows and the things that they're watching, almost always there's an adversarial relationship between siblings. I don't know about you guys. I didn't like I'd turn those shows off. You know, you don't get to watch shows where the little brother is always a pest or where the big sister is always annoyed. So I think a piece of that social time, there's no reason it can't be siblings.

Liz: Like, Right.

Rebecca: You were talking about Liza. But the sorting out of the relationships, like putting in the effort to learn to see your sibling as a friend. If you don't lay out that expectation to your kids that they can be friends with one another, then the culture will come in and tell them that they're not supposed to be and that it won't work. When my kids were little and we were living overseas, so many people came and went that I often told them, I don't. I don't know which of your friends are going to be here, you know, after a while, but your siblings will be. So it's okay to learn to play with them, to learn to solve those problems. And so I think that is also a social outlet that they can have a hundred percent.

Liza: Yeah.

Rebecca: So when people ask me what they should be doing for TK or kindergarten, I often tell them, read, play, and sing. Read, play, and sing.

Liza: That's good.

Rebecca: I like that. So we'll have to keep this part short because the three of us could talk about this for days.

Liz: Please join us Next week for our second podcast on the subject of reading, playing and singing.

Liza: We only covered reading and see today.

Rebecca: So talk about books. What do those look like in your home? Feel free to shout out a few favorites, like, which ones did you come back to over and over? Did you only read picture books? Did you do chapter books?

Liz: Well, I am. I am, like, deep in that right now, and I am fighting against the books that my boys adore right now, which is Curious George. I'm just kind of over George. But they love them so much. We have, like, I don't know if there's more than three, but we have the red one, the blue one, and the yellow one. And we.

Rebecca: The compilations.

Liz: You read them over and over and over, and they love them. But I like Margaret Wise Brown and I like. What was the Shelly. Oh, the one with Dogger. Do you guys remember?

Rebecca: Oh, yeah.

Liz: Talking about.

Rebecca: Yeah, Shirley. Shirley.

Liz: Shirley Hughes. Oh, I have the Shirley Hughes compilation and they're just the sweetest. I love it when they have gorgeous pictures, interesting pictures. Actually, one of her best stories is it has no words. It's just these really cool pictures about this little girl who wants to fly, and she ends up flying in this. You know, she. She gets into all sorts of mischief and she gets chased around and eventually she has to come back because an old man, like, pops her balloon with his umbrella. And it's funny, like, little picture series and the kids just watch it and you can tell, like, they have the whole story going on in words. But anyway, lots of good books. Lots of variations in books. So they have, you know, different vocabulary coming in. But mostly if we're excited about it, they're excited about it. And. Yeah, yeah, I would.

Liza: I mean, so many come to mind. We just read the Three Little Wolves and the Big Bad Pig today, which is a fun variation. We love that one. And animals should definitely not wear clothing.

Rebecca: Oh, that's a good one.

Liza: And, you know, porcupines and. Yeah, I mean, I. I would say also what I find that is so fun about reading to them. I mean, sometimes it's like fallen serious as they're reading it, as you're reading it to them. But I would say either in the preschool setting or with my own kids, each time it does come alive in a different way each time. You know, like, I remember the other day we pulled out a book on vultures, and it was one of those things you never know what's going to take. That's the thing that's so magical about teaching at this age. You're kind of like they see something that you didn't see or it becomes a jumping off point for a totally different discussion about, you know, carcasses and, you know, skeletons and. Oh, and my dad also, you know. Yeah. So I find that so awesome just to see the inner workings of their mind as they ask questions or oftentimes just have comments to.

Liz: Yeah.

Liza: Yes. But so I would say all of those. We love Mrs. Piggle Wiggle with my kids as they got older. And then chapter books. The Sign of the Sign of the Beaver, one of my favorites. Danny, the champion of the world. But yeah, mostly at the preschool level. We're obviously in more picture books.

Rebecca: When I think of you in picture books, I think of Gyofujikama. Did I say the name right?

Liza: Oh, yes. Is it the you guys gave all.

Rebecca: In a happy day. One day I'll have to look. I'll put it in. I'll put it in the show notes. But.

Liza: Oh, oh, oh. Yes, I know what you mean.

Rebecca: You gave us that book and I think maybe it was.

Liza: Oh, what a busy day.

Rebecca: Oh, what a busy day. That's it. Yes.

Liza: And those are those. The intricacies of those. The pictures illustration are so.

Rebecca: Yeah. And you, you gave us that. And I remember Dave, I think Dave wrote in it and said this book really packs a punch or something like that. And so it was actually often when we would travel, that's one of the books I would bring because there was so much in it that I didn't have to bring as many books.

Liza: Yeah, Richard. Scary the same way. You're like, okay, I've got a bunch within it.

Rebecca: When you were talking about how different kids see different things, I would read Goodnight Gorilla, which is still a favorite. Like there's so. There's so much in those pictures. You notice things for like you can read it a hundred times and you probably still notice things, but they also, they seem simple. So you don't realize that that's gonna.

Liz: Right.

Liza: What's going on? Yeah.

Rebecca: What color, how the keys match different colors and all these things. But what cracked me up was that one of my boys was so worried that the bunch of bananas that was hanging from the top of the cage was going to fall on that gorilla's head. And it just cracked me up. And he's still my little safety officer.

Liza: That is so good.

Rebecca: And that was a two or three. You know, he was very worried about those bananas.

Liza: Oh, we were back to the. The book we read today. It was interesting, that idea of a changed heart too. That's in the Three Little Wolves and the Big Bag Pig. And one of them made the connection. Oh, it's like the Grinch whose heart grew three sides. But those kind of connections are like either actually sort of synthesizing information and jumping in their book. Another really good one that is hard to read, ends in a cry for the parents, oftentimes is Selfish Giant. Have you guys read that? Oscar Wilde. It's a beautiful. And yeah, I've heard of it, I.

Rebecca: Think, but I don't think I've read it.

Liza: Yeah, but yeah, it's. And it's, you know, choosing when to read certain things. Right. Because things can be sensitive and, you know, you just have to know what to choose when. But those are special.

Rebecca: So tell me the whys. Why do you read to your kids? I talk about reading to my kids all the time. Why is it an intricate part of your families? Why did you both light up when I said, let's talk about books?

Liz: Well, I think it stems from us loving books.

Liza: Yeah.

Liz: It's such a beautiful thing to be able to read letters and they come alive and they tell a story and they paint a picture and they show you a world that you've never been in. And they can open up cultures that we might never experience and even in the young years, take them places that we might never go. Be able to empathize with people in ways that we wouldn't have understood, explain ourselves in ways that we might not be able to explain otherwise. And I know a lot of people talk about all of the beautiful dialect that they're absorbing the vocabulary. You know, even if none of that existed, I would still say just being able to see the world differently through a book is worthwhile, even if you learned nothing else other than to see the world new. We're. I'm reading a book with Nick right now called Simon B. Ryman, and it's about a little boy who's very culturally different than us. I'm growing up in Chicago, and I'm just ecstatic that he's reading a book about someone so different and yet so similar to him. He's the same age, he has a lot of the same feelings, but he's got a very different life. And Nick doesn't know why. I'm really excited about him reading that instead of a dragon book. And it's just. It's just a silly book. It's. It's not one of those deep ones that maybe it'll have a few some feelings at the end, but it's Just showing him a different person than he might honestly ever meet in our little county. So I, I'm pushing through and saying let's keep on reading this one. And you know, like the little books that I read, the picture books, they still have elements that are like that. I'm not going to try to pronounce the name that you pronounced a minute ago.

Rebecca: Gyofujikama, I believe or Fujikawa.

Liz: She has a book that talks about all sorts of feelings and my 5 year old boy loves it and my 2 year old also. And they look at all of the different pictures and some of them they're not all about feelings. But there is the one about sometimes you just have a bad day and you stub your foot the first thing in the morning and it's a bad day and you fall out of the tub and it's a bad day and you get in a fight with your sister and it's a bad day. And it ends with that's okay. There's always tomorrow. Tomorrow might be a very good day.

Liza: Yeah.

Liz: And he loves it.

Liza: So good. It's like Alexander made terrible, horrible. Even in Australia I know they still.

Liz: Have bad days there. We're the one about bedtime for France. Francis.

Liza: Yes.

Liz: I love it. That's almost like therapeutic for parents, right? Absolutely.

Rebecca: So where's my cake?

Liza: I feel like Francis feels like you. I don't know. So sort of like smart and kind of like. I don't know. I'm going to figure this out and work the system in just the right way. I was going to say there's a.

Rebecca: Monster in my room and can I have a piece of ca.

Liza: Oh, Calvin and Hobbes. Another great one which has just is literally tattered and we've had all sorts of family.

Rebecca: I think had it since he was in about seventh grade.

Liza: Yes. And we have. It's every morning with cereal. One of the girls is reading it at this point. We have two at home. But it's just such a treasure and again grows with you with age. It's like you're like peeling back the layers. I loved what you said, Liz. And totally agree. And so. And I was sort of thinking for why do we read? It's almost like to be understood and to understand and I realize like, I think, I mean both of those. You were saying empathy and so amazing. And then to really feel. I think sometimes yeah. Children can feel alone and haven't even created the language around what they're feeling. And it is confusing and it is overwhelming and then suddenly they see in a book or a character. And I could see how you just would sort of rest and you would feel at peace to feel like, oh, it is out there. Someone else feels this way. And so I think that would be. I mean, I know I felt that as I grew and read certain books and sort of. And then also the imagination of who you can become. I think that's a beautiful one. I remember reading Jane Eyre and feeling like, that's the woman I want to be. And I want Miss Rochester to fall in love with me. Right, Miss Rochester.

Liz: Yes.

Rebecca: You did not find Mr. Rochester.

Liz: Sort of.

Liza: No. But you realize more than that, more than the love stuff, but realizing those characters where you're like, she chose the hard thing, and I want to do that. And to see it lived out in a life through, even fiction, is just a beautiful thing.

Rebecca: This might need to. We may need to have a second episode. But for them to wrap this up, I would say reading books with kids is not extra agree or disagree. Like, that's a chunk of actual education and growth.

Liz: That should be the. If you only have one thing to do that day, that's what you do.

Liza: Yeah, yeah. Because also, I would say with that, I know we were talking about the whole counting and math thing, but, like, again, in every illustration, there's just like, you could go endless places. Right. And so if you wanted to, you felt like, I do want them to sort of get 1 to 5 down because you're like, yeah, just, you know.

Rebecca: How many bears are in this picture?

Liza: Exactly. And just get them sort of fluent in that type of thing. And so it's a nice way where you're not shoving in their face and like saying, let's do a worksheet, you know, but you're actually saying, let's use this.

Liz: And in addition, pardon the pun, you can learn math quickly. Right? Yeah, I've, like. I always relate back to when my brother David and Lance learned trigonometry in a couple months so that they could apply for a job.

Liza: Yeah.

Liz: If needed, you can learn math real fast, but you can't develop the depth that literature can give you quickly. Like, it needs to be layer on, layer on layer. It needs to be continuous. You need to start early and just keep going. And if you're a year behind in math, they really can make that year up when they're a little bit older, in summer. I'm not saying, like, don't start them in math until they're in seventh grade. I'm just saying, really, if you have time to read to your kids or do math with your kids. Read to your kid.

Rebecca: Yeah, listeners, as you can tell, we just kept talking and talking and talking and so we ran out of time. So I am cutting this conversation in half and I hope that you will join back next week to hear the continued conversation with Liz and Liza all about our littlest homeschoolers. We have lots more to talk about and you need time anyway to go look up all those books that we were talking about. You'll find the whole list in the show notes and you could have a very rich library by getting your hands on some of those books. So join us back next week as we continue our conversation all about our little people and how to help them grow and be healthy and ready to learn all about this big world. Thank you for joining me today on the Sequoia Breeze Podcast, a breath of fresh air for your homeschool. I've been your host, Rebecca LaSavio, you and I look forward to having you join us again next week. As always, please share this podcast with somebody that you think it would be helpful to and I'd love to hear from you@podcast Grove.org.